[00:00:09,340] [Jamie:] Hello and welcome to CoachCast by England Football Learning, the coaching podcast that brings you insight from people across the game. Today we're chatting to Bex Garlick, the FAE's National Coach Development Lead for Women and Girls, to discover her journey so far and her advice for building connections with players. Well, welcome to the studio. Welcome back, Bex, how are you?
[00:00:31,240] [Bex Garlick:] I'm good, thank you. How are you?
[00:00:32,699] [Jamie:] Not bad, thank you very much.
[00:00:34,340] [Louise:] It's lovely to have you on again. So for those who perhaps didn't hear the last episode that you were on, can you tell us a little bit about your role, a brief explanation of what your role is and what you do in the FA?
[00:00:44,700] [Bex Garlick:] Yes, So I'm the coach development lead for Women and Girls and also the East Region. So in the East Region we work with the coach development officers and the county FAs within the East to deliver their generic coach development offer to coaches across those counties in that region. From a women and girls perspective, I lead nationally, again, working with eight coach development officers and our work is really targeted at getting more females into coaching and making sure that once they're in, they are supported at the first stages of their journey, helping to build their confidence and just make them comfortable on the grass.
[00:01:20,060] [Jamie:] Brilliant. Fantastic. Well, Bex, before we dive deeper in to find a little bit more about you, as this is a coaching podcast, listeners could be on the way to training right now. So we feel like it's a good idea to give them some top tips at the start of the show.
[00:01:32,680] [Louise:] Yep, this is your arrival activity to warm you up. So we're going to give you 30 seconds and we're going to ask you to give us as many top coaching tips as you can in those 30 seconds. Are you up for the challenge?
[00:01:46,120] [Bex Garlick:] I think so, I'm feeling a bit on the spot here now.
[00:01:50,340] [Louise:] We'll put some music on and when that starts that will be your cue to begin, okay?
[00:01:56,500] [Bex Garlick:] So as you drive in think about how can you most effectively use your space tonight, How can you get them into something as soon as they arrive, even if they arrive in their dribs and drabs? What's the first thing that you're gonna get the first one to arrive on task with? And the checklist I always use when leaving my session is, were they engaged? Were they safe? And did they leave having learnt something? And if I've still got some time, goals, opposition and direction.
[00:02:27,180] [Jamie:] Perfect. Love that. Yeah. Love that. Some great tips for people on the way to training. So hopefully they put them to good use.
[00:02:32,320] [Bex Garlick:] I felt like I was on a game show.
[00:02:35,580] [Jamie:] That is the vibe that we're going for in this studio for sure. Right Bex, well let's get into the rest of the show and learn a little bit about you and we always ask everybody who comes on the show, the first question is, what was your first experience of football like?
[00:02:49,740] [Bex Garlick:] I think my first experience, I'm told by my family, was as a spectator. I think I got taken to my first Sheffield Wednesday game at the age of two. And obviously I've been going ever since, which isn't always the most rewarding of experiences based on how we usually play. I think in terms of playing football, again, I remember I probably enjoyed it the most when we used to play on the road. So there was like our lane and then there was another lane connecting and there was kids at the bottom of the lane and kids at the top of the lane so we used to basically, there was this guy's house and he like lived in Australia but he used to let us use the field behind his house so we had a football pitch set up, we had goals and everything and it used to be top of the lane versus bottom of the lane. But because I was the youngest and I was the only girl, I just always wanted to be on the winning team. So I'd get transferred every now and then to either the bottom or the top of the lane. So that was probably my first experience of coaching and just playing with my brothers and the lads on our road. I think probably my first formal experience was, yeah, usually being the only girl either on a holiday camp or at the local football team. And I think that probably has driven my coaching journey and philosophy really because I'll be honest I wasn't the best player. I always tell people I retired at 16 which was when I got into coaching but what I guess I had in my mind when I did start coaching was probably the levels of frustration that I felt as a player because I was the only girl and because in like school and things they didn't really have a girl's team no one would ever want to take the team we had to beg our form tutor I think to start a girl's team but he he said he'd take us for the games but he never really wanted to coach us so I guess that frustration of not being properly coached and not being very good probably really drove how I approached coaching and being able to empathise with some of the younger players that were struggling like myself.
[00:04:48,314] [Louise:] I can see that being a real driver to you wanting to go on to coach. So can you tell us a little bit more about your first experience of coaching then, since you were on that?
[00:04:56,580] [Bex Garlick:] Yeah, I was 16. My cousin was 6 and he started going down to the local football team that we, both my brother and I, had been involved with when we were younger and it was just like a Saturday morning session that you used to go to and I'd obviously go and watch him with my auntie and uncle. The guy, Ricky, who led the club at the time, who again we knew because we'd been involved, He just asked me one day if I wanted to get involved and help. So yeah, I remember there were about 30 - 6 year olds just running around this field and he was like, tell you what, you do the warm up. And I literally had no idea what I was doing, but I absolutely loved it and I think my cousin loved it. And I guess what I really liked about it was I always wanted to be a teacher. So I was really passionate about wanting to go into teaching. I loved working with young people and I loved football. So I realised, I think quite early on, having been dragged over the sidelines, that actually this combined a number of passions and probably this could be a route that I would like to go down as a job. So I just started doing it every Saturday morning, but because I was young and fresh they ended up getting me involved with some of the other teams. I think I ended up taking like the under 10 girls teams and yeah just continued that journey with my cousin really. He still goes on about me for making him do laps of the pitch which he's never let me live down and I feel terrible for him because obviously knowing what I do now I just wouldn't ever make him do that. But yeah, he's still there. He's 21 now. He's actually coaching himself as well, which is quite nice. But yeah, he always has a go at me for making him run laps of the pitch. Sorry, Oliver, if you're listening.
[00:06:30,120] [Jamie:] What is it then that you enjoy about coaching?
[00:06:33,740] [Bex Garlick:] I think just seeing the enjoyment of the young players I've worked across a variety of different age groups But yeah if you if you had to make me choose who would I prefer to work with I just love like working with the young ones and just seeing the enjoyment that they get from it, seeing their excitement as they arrive at training or on match day, seeing how they all interact with each other and just the different dynamics between them and the different relationships that they form and how it brings young people from different backgrounds as well together and how they end up just being friends whereas they probably wouldn't have otherwise been friends had football not brought them together. And I just think being able to see that development of players as well. Again, seeing someone really struggling and supporting and helping them and putting them in the right practices to develop and just seeing them thrive is, yeah, I think that's what I get the biggest buzz from really.
[00:07:29,760] [Louise:] Really rewarding. What would you say are the key attributes and skills that make a transformational coach?
[00:07:36,400] [Bex Garlick:] I think just being able to know what your players need at certain moments and choosing to dial up or dial down certain attributes or skills. So when do they need you to be that bit more warming? When do they need you to be that little bit more direct? When do they need you to almost give them the answers? When do they need you to show them? When do they need you to allow them to find their own way. So I think being a transformational coach is being able to recognise what your players need, when they need it and how they need it, in what format and what approach to take. So yeah, I would say that's what makes a transformational coach. But I think if I was to look at myself as a coach, I just always try and be as positive and engaging as I can. I try to enable the players to make as many decisions for themselves because ultimately it's them who are gonna be making the decisions on the pitch once they step over that line. So yeah, how can we make it as player-centred as possible for them, rather than me as the coach dictating and directing what we want them to do.
[00:08:44,159] [Jamie:] Those skills and that approach, Did you take that from like any coaches or teachers when you're younger or given your experience that you've just talked about, maybe was there a lack of individuals that potentially you thought might have been transformational that you've took stuff from into your coaching?
[00:08:57,520] [Bex Garlick:] You know what, everyone always asks me like who inspired me and I really struggle. Like there's so many different people who have, yeah, like you say, either shown me how to do things or shown me how not to do things. It was probably only as I got further into my career that I started to be inspired by coaches. So I guess the obvious one is like your Pete Sturgess, just the way in which he speaks to the kids and how the language that he uses and how he articulates stuff with such like infectious passion. And there was Another guy that I used to coach with when I was in the skills program who was very similar to Pete, a guy called Scott Davis. And again, the way he used to articulate stuff, but just how he used to make the, what can often probably be quite complex, really simple. You know, like the terminology and the football stuff, you just used to talk to the kids in a way that was just so like simple and just so easy to understand. So they're probably two that always stick out in my head but I don't know if we're gonna go on to this in a minute, but probably it's more it's probably my mum who helped me more so at the start of my coaching journey to inspire me really and help me on my first steps.
[00:10:08,940] [Jamie:] Wow, do you want to explain why that's the case, why your mum inspired you?
[00:10:12,940] [Bex Garlick:] So when I started coaching with my cousin's team, I had like 30 odd kids every Saturday morning, all from different backgrounds, all with their different challenges, all got different reasons why they wanted to be there. And yeah, it was a struggle at times. And I remember Saturday mornings at the football club were like in-house mini soccer basically so you'd split however many kids you had into teams and they just played, they just played matches so you do like a bit of a warm-up but then you had to like assign the parents to coach a team. Back then it was probably really quite forward-thinking really. But yeah, I just remember coming home there'd always be something like one of the kids had done something or something had happened or the parents had said something or whatever it was and I remember just coming home and me and my mum used to have like a Saturday morning brief over a sausage butty. My mum was, at the time, she had quite a lot of involvement in like safeguarding and child protection and working with kids with challenging behaviours. So we just used to sit and chat about that really. And that probably, because like, if I think now to what we're trying to help coaches with, I think often that's the stuff that's the most challenging, like the football bit's usually the easiest bit, especially if you've watched and played. The challenging bit is just how do you manage those behaviours and manage the other challenging stuff. So yeah, we just used to sit and just chat about what we were seeing, what was happening. And she'd just give me advice and then the week after I'd try it and I'd be like, oh mum, that worked or mum don't tell me to do that again because he did this. So yeah, I guess she was probably the one who helped me at that very early stage. And yeah, probably the reason why I'm where I am today, I guess.
[00:12:00,980] [Louise:] It's definitely interesting how all these little things you think back on them as you get older and think oh that's really like changed my pathway or the way that I think in this in some ways so yeah it's really interesting. So we've kind of skipped over a little bit can you tell us a little bit about your like how your career developed so going from doing a bit of coaching to kind of where you are now?
[00:12:21,860] [Bex Garlick:] Yeah so obviously I was doing my Saturday mornings and as a result of volunteering all that time the club actually put me on my my level one or what is now the introduction to coaching football. So I did that and there were just a few people who was like, one of the parents, his son played. He was the head of sport at the college that used to lend us the facilities for the club. So he offered me to help out with some football camps. So I used to do those. There was a guy that played at the club in the senior team, he did his football camp. So I just got involved in those in the summer and I just absolutely loved it. And I think I came home one day and said, Mum, I think I've decided what I want to go to uni to do. I want to do this as a career. I want to work for the FA. My mum is pretty good with stuff like that. She was like, right, if that's what you want to do, then work out how you're going to get there. Obviously I'd tell some other people and they were a bit like, you do know there's not many girls work for the FA, don't you? Which at the time there wasn't. This was like 2005 - 6. So yeah, just ended up going to university. They didn't have sports coaching degrees back then. That's how old I am. I had to go and do sports development with PE because I still had this thing in my head that if it all goes wrong, I can always go and be a PE teacher and have that to fall back on. And whilst I was at uni, I just got loads more coaching experience, got involved with Liverpool and Everton in the community, was introduced to my first county FA, Liverpool FA. They were amazing. The people I met there, I still keep in touch with them. One of them ended up being my first line manager and was a huge inspiration to me. And they introduced me to like Everton Centre of Excellence for Girls, which is probably what would be the equivalent to a regional talent club now. So I just got a variety of different experiences. The sports campus I was on, they had school activity days and holiday camps during the summer, so I did all them. So it just put me in a really good stead for when I came out of university and I was so lucky that at that point the skills programme were recruiting for their next round of coaches, applied for the job and got it and I've been here ever since.
[00:14:23,520] [Louise:] Achieving your dream, which is good.
[00:14:26,040] [Jamie:] How have those experiences helped to develop you into the person you are today and also how do they help you in your role at the FA now?
[00:14:34,540] [Bex Garlick:] I think firstly just the variety of contexts in which I worked in I think really helped me. So working in schools, working in clubs, working in communities, working with variety of age groups, again young people from various backgrounds. I think it just helps you to work out what people need and how to give them the best possible experience based on those needs and wants. Even just the differences, So I started in the skills program in Cheshire and then after two years went to Manchester and like, they're just a difference in kids cause you've got like kids from rural area compared to like kids from inner city. It was just so different and you had to constantly adapt and just like I said, dial up and down those different skills and attributes. So I think that put me in a really good stead. And I think I'd just, yeah, probably just say the people that I met along the way spoke about my mum. And again, I think without realising those conversations that we used to have made me see the young people that I was working with differently. Because you only see their behaviours, but what my mum was probably challenging me to do without me realising was look deeper than that, look at why they're behaving the way in which they are. So I think that really put me in good stead to connect with players and try and empathise and really understand what's driving their behaviours and how can I best help them? I was also not particularly, you might be shocked at this, the way I've bounced in here today, but I wasn't a particularly confident person. And I think some of the people that I met along the way and how they, again, knew what to do with me. So I mentioned, like, one of the guys at Liverpool FA who ended up being my line manager. I was describing him as like that safety net. He knew when to throw me in at the deep end, but I knew that he was always there to help me and, yeah, fish me out of situations if I needed him to. Some of the other people that worked at that county FA, just their personalities and how they used their personalities to connect with people was absolutely massive. So yeah, I think just the people that I've met along the way have been, I've been so lucky in just meeting good people who really cared and really saw my potential and wanted to help me, but also demonstrated through their behaviours probably some of the things I wanted to be and as time's gone on I've hopefully been able to grow into being some of those things I think, being that bit more confident.
[00:16:57,497] [Louise:] I think listening to your experiences and your background and stuff it probably explains why you went on to do this but you've recently completed a Master's in Psychology. So firstly congratulations on that.
[00:17:08,220] [Bex Garlick:] Thank you.
[00:17:09,280] [Louise:] And secondly, could you share a few insights into what your focus was and the learnings from it that could help coaches listening to this podcast?
[00:17:18,900] [Bex Garlick:] Yeah, so when I went in to do this Masters, it got to dissertation time. I was just trying to think what I wanted to write it on and the reason I went into doing that, the Masters in the first place was because I was, I do this, I get stuff in my head and then I just make a bold decision to go and do something about it. So I was really interested in kind of the wellbeing and what is called the player care role, which is quite a new role within academies. And I was just a bit, yeah, just interested in it really because I'd listened to a few podcasts, read a few kind of articles and books around just well-being within elite sport if you like and I just wanted to explore what that looked and felt like in the talent space of within football in this country. So in my dissertation a lot of my experiences have obviously been grassroots and that's where my passion lies. So I wanted to just do something a little bit different and like I said have a look at what that player care role kind of looked like within academies and what did it mean but also how did it complement or not complement what was happening on the grass from a coaching perspective? So yeah, I can't remember what it was a pretty long title, but it was yeah the the role of player care within Academy football. I think it was in the youth development phase I think the key learnings that came from it, and I will try and link this back to Grassroots if I can, so the player care role is new. Obviously a lot of clubs have got like sports psychologists, player care seems to sit slightly different. So sports psychology from my perspective seems to be more focused on performance, where the player care role is very much around the wellbeing of the player and probably dealing with the person first rather than the player, which is obviously why I'm quite passionate about it. But I think because it is so new, it's challenging to see where it kind of fits and how does it complement the sports psychology role. How does it fit into what they call the multidisciplinary team that they have within the academy spaces? I guess what I felt was just how could we explore that role further and how could it complement the coaches more as well and how could we integrate player care Possibly into a number of different roles. So how can we integrate player care into the role of the coach? So And I always think back to an example where I was here, there was a group of players on the 3G and I watched this player and he, like, you could hear his dad shouting and I remember that the kid just like stormed off the pitch and my first glance was at the coaches to see what they would do and to be honest I don't think they, I'm not sure they saw him at first because he literally like just walked off halfway through the game but just observing him and where he went and sat for the team talk he was sat right at the back he had his head down just watching his body language and I guess that was where I kind of thought to myself like in my coaching experiences would I have noticed that and what might I have done differently in that situation. So I think yeah just thinking back to my role as a coach now and how it might apply to grassroots is how can we really start to notice the behaviors and the body language of the players? What are they telling us without telling us? So they, verbally they won't specifically tell us but what are they telling us through their body language and through their behaviours? And how can we just start to explore a little bit around that and why they're perhaps behaving in the way that they do? Why are they responding or reacting in the way that they are? And I think it can be quite frustrating as a coach. I was chatting to a coach that I took through a course recently, I've kept in touch with him, and he was telling me about this this player that he's got and he said sometimes during a match he walks off the pitch crying but other times he'll be like really stroppy and he'll be quite aggressive and I just said to him how is your behavior based on which one of those he does and he kind of paused for a moment and he said do you know what Bex he said I'm probably different in both situations he said but there's probably a similar reason as to why he's storming off. So when he's crying I'm a bit more sympathetic and it's a bit like arm round and come on it's okay, but when he's a bit aggressive or when he's throwing a bit of a strop, I probably get frustrated with him because that's not the behaviours we want to see on a football pitch. So I think it just fascinated me that particular example and really brought it to life that, yeah, how much do we take the opportunity to, as coaches, delve into why certain behaviours are happening and why players are responding in the way that they do. And does our behaviour always help? So if I meet frustration with frustration that's probably not helping anyone but actually if I meet it with empathy and understanding as I would if they were crying then that is probably a little bit more helpful. So yeah, very long-winded answer to just thinking about, to me that is player care in a coaching role, really caring about why the kids are responding and reacting the way they do and how can we explore that with them? How can we help them to understand it because they might be reacting in a way and they don't understand what that emotion means. So how can we just dig a little bit deeper into it so we can understand it but we can help them to understand it and hopefully get them to a point where they perhaps respond or react in a more positive way.
[00:22:36,420] [Jamie:] This sort of theme is what we really want to dive into and explore further in this episode. So this may sound obvious but in order to provide players then with what they need and recognising what's going on. How important is it for coaches to get to know them, first of all?
[00:22:50,800] [Bex Garlick:] I think it's massive. I think, yeah, just really understanding not just what their interests are in terms of who they support, why they come to football, but just trying to understand a little bit about what home life is like for them, what school's like for them, who are their friends, what are their interests outside of football. I think that's where you can really start to build connection and trust and when you remember that stuff their little faces like just light up because they're like how have you remembered what my dog's called? So I think it's just really important. And once you've built that trust and that connection to then have to, if you need to, have those probably what are more difficult conversations for them around their emotions and their responses and their behaviours, it becomes that little bit easier because they hopefully already trust you that little bit because you've taken the time to get to know them and build that up with them.
[00:23:42,527] [Louise:] You've mentioned schools and what have you there and it being kids, do you think it applies to adults as well?
[00:23:47,680] [Bex Garlick:] Yeah, I've done this with the adults that I've worked with. For me it's just people skills in general, it's just what you would do with anyone you came into contact with, so why would you not do it within your coaching? So yeah, again just getting to know the, if I've worked with an adult team, getting what's their home life like, have they got kids, what's family life like for them, what do they do for a job, what challenges them about their job, all those sorts of things. So you can have those conversations with them as well.
[00:24:13,860] [Louise:] And do you have any tips or ways that you would go about getting to know someone?
[00:24:19,020] [Bex Garlick:] That's a great question. I think you just gotta like, obviously the easy one when they arrive at training is just how was your day? And again with the younger ones it's often, it was alright. What was alright about it? Have you been to school? I guess probably just questioning is really key and I always say with questioning, never just take the first answer. So again, if how was your day? I was alright. Well, don't just take that as like probe a bit more and ask another question and you might just get a little bit more out about what was alright about it, what was the bit you enjoyed the most, what was the bit you didn't enjoy the most. Again they might go, oh well the bit I enjoyed the most was coming home. And then again you can just delve a little bit further, what is it that you like about going home and usually then it starts to come out around, oh well I knew I was having spag bol for my tea or whatever and again you can just start to just pick up on little little bits that they tell you and you necessarily have to expand on that in the moment. The key bit is to just pocket it and remember it. So if they tell you what the name of the dog was or what the name of their brother or sister is or what the favourite thing is for tea, again like if they've done then something really well in training you'll be like, was it spag bol for tea? That kind of thing because you're on fire tonight and it just gives them that little boost but again it tells them that you've listened they might have told you that six weeks ago but you've you've listened and you've remembered and I think that's that's really important for for anyone I always feel nice when people remember things about me so I try and remember things about others.
[00:25:48,150] [Jamie:] It's a good tip to take away, I really like that, really important to pocket that information and use it because yeah it's such a such a big motivational factor you know that someone's listened and really taking the time to get to know you as a person.
[00:26:01,160] [Bex Garlick:] There's a guy I know that I used to tutor with but when he's coaching he goes one step beyond. He's got a book and he's got a page for each player and he'll write things in like that. So he'll write football stuff in and like you know what positions have they played, what have they tried, what have they struggled with but he will write little things like that in just to remember. Again, you're either pocketing your brain or you're pocketing it in on a piece of paper but yeah quite a nice little thing that he does.
[00:26:26,956] [Jamie:] I really like that. In the build up to this episode and of course throughout it as well you've kind of been highlighting to us like how key observational skills actually are. Can you tell everyone then how you use it and how it helps you to develop connections with your players then?
[00:26:40,400] [Bex Garlick:] Yeah, so I think observation is massive across coaching in general And we often talk about observation and how we use our observation skills to recognise the six capabilities within players. So that from kind of a football perspective, what's their movement like? What's their positioning? What's their timing like? What's the technique? So we observe across those six capabilities, which is great because that tells us loads about the players as footballers. But I think also there's another side to observation which is linked to them as people and really understanding them as people. And it's just taking the time to probably look away from the ball sometimes and just looking over it. I find it fascinating. Like I think I mentioned it at the start, like how they interact with people. What's the dynamics? How do they respond when certain things happen? So again, there's a recent example in my coaching week, there's a player and then one morning another player came in and she's got the same name as this player. So they've introduced this player and said a name and before I did anything else I looked straight to the other player because I knew that that would affect her and I knew what her response would be. And just watching her response to that and her body language and how that made her feel. And as that happened I'm trying to in my head work out what is that meaning in her head, what is she thinking right now, how is she processing that and I think yeah again just pocketing that information and just seeing how she deals with it because I sensed that it was a potential threat to her that someone now in the group had the same name as her Yeah, just kept an eye on it for it for a few weeks And sometimes you don't even do anything with the information you just pocket it and you just keep it there But if you can see that it's really affecting them that might give you a bit of a gateway into having a conversation with them. I think just sometimes telling them what you've noticed. So my good friend of mine, Sally Needham, she's given me, I'm not even gonna remember this but I'm gonna try, sorry Sally. She tells me that use wings or try and remember it as wings for when you are having to then have conversations about things you've observed. So wondering, imagining, noticing, guessing, sensing. So using those words as almost a kind of starting point. So I've noticed when that happened, you did this, and I'm wondering what that's about, or how that, I'm wondering how that made you feel. So you can just start to use those words to just dig a little bit into how something's made them feel, what emotions it's drawn out of them. Yeah and just making those conversations normal. They can feel a bit uncomfortable for you as coaches at first and it can be a bit uncomfortable for the players at first but if we never have those conversations we never help them to understand their emotions and that's really important because yeah like I said linking back to that coach that I was telling you about before, if a kid's storming off a pitch or is walking off a pitch crying, there's something there that's triggering that so we have to get to the bottom of that because otherwise that's going to continue to happen and that player might get to a point where they just don't enjoy football anymore and we wouldn't ever want to get to that point. So those conversations are crucial.
[00:29:53,236] [Louise:] So if you recognise particular behaviours, is there a particular way that you would approach or change your practice around that player?
[00:30:01,920] [Bex Garlick:] That comes back to knowing the player. Again, I had a player last year, one of the other players came up to me and said, they've just said this to me and I'm thinking, wow that's not a very nice thing to say. But Knowing the player, straight away you're trying to make a judgement of would that player say that? Why would they say it? Would they say it in jest? Would they say it as just a bit of an off-the-cuff comment? So you're already starting to make a judgement based on what you know about the player. I think sometimes it's good to know all that stuff, but it's also trying to park that so it doesn't cloud your judgment too much, but you can use what you do know about them to work out how you're going to deal with it. So I knew that if I approached that player, confronted them and said, someone says, you've just said this to them. I knew what their reaction would be. And I knew that they'd start to panic. I knew that they'd be worried that their parent was going to find out. I knew that they'd be worried that they might not be allowed to play for the team, all that sort of stuff, because I knew that player and what previous responses had been like. So I really had to think about how I broached that situation but at the same time I'm thinking I have to ask this question because as much as we want to understand the behaviour and why it's happened and what was the driving force behind it. We can never ignore a behaviour because if what has been said has been said, that behaviour isn't okay. So it's not about ignoring behaviours, it's about shining a light on those behaviours. If they're not okay, they need to understand that, but how do we deal with it based on how we think they'll respond so yeah I just went up to them and said this players just said you've said this and straight away tears got all the reactions that I knew I was gonna get And in that moment I knew that they needed reassurance, that I wasn't judging them. So I said, listen, I've not said that because I think you've said it, but I'm only repeating what that player's told me. So let's go for a walk around the pitch and let's just have a chat about what's just happened there. I think I provided like some reassurance, like we're just going to walk around the pitch, it's just going to be a conversation between me and you, let's just explore what's just happened there. Just to try and put that reassurance, but still taking that time as we had that walk around the pitch and trying to provide that reassurance that mum wasn't gonna find out and she wasn't gonna be asked to leave or whatever but still making sure that she knew that that behavior wasn't okay but I took that approach based on what I knew about that player. If it had been another player, I might have taken a completely different approach. So I think the way in which you deal with situations as they arise is very much based on adapting to what you know about the player. And I think sometimes people challenge that and say, well, is that fair? And are you treating them all the same? And I take that argument, but I also think that you can be fair, but still not treat people the same because you have to understand what they will respond best to in that moment. So I think, yeah, you will always adapt your approach based on who it is in front of you. But the important bit is still shining a light on that behaviour and making sure that they know that that behaviour in that moment isn't okay.
[00:33:13,320] [Jamie:] Do you have any top tips for coaches who, hopefully having listened to this, they're going to kind of be looking and observing a little bit more maybe than they have already. Have you got any top tips for like the sort of body language maybe that they could see that maybe would suggest somebody's maybe a little bit out of character, out of sorts and something they might need a little bit of an intervention there at all.
[00:33:34,060] [Bex Garlick:] You've got to do the work before the situation arises. So this isn't just something that we switch on to do in a session. This is something that we do every session and taking the time to just observe a particular player for a few minutes. Cause there's always players that take up a lot of your time and energy and attention because they're loud or because they'll show behaviors that you've got to deal with, where there's the quieter ones that just go about the business and I think it's consciously making a decision as the coach to go, do you know what, I don't feel like I know that much about that player, I'm gonna watch that player for a few minutes today because I've not seen loads of them and I don't really feel like I know them as well as I know that one who causes me a challenge every week. So I think it's taking time to observe them all. So then when something does happen or something does arise, you can spot when it is out of character. So that would be my top tip. I think you asked me about like adapting practices and stuff because there's probably another almost middle ground to this. So we've gone from one extreme to the other so we can observe the football stuff around the six capabilities. We can go really deep and start observing like body language and behaviors and reactions and responses. So you're probably really in like the psychological corner there. Probably the middle ground, which is probably a bit easier to spot, is like when they're all in a practice, how do we know when they're bored? Or how do we know when they're fed up or when we need to move it on and that's probably in the middle because there's some football stuff in there but then there's some probably psychological stuff in there as well. My biggest trigger for knowing when they're bored or when they're fed up is the tempo drops and the energy drops and again it's constantly looking and observing for when that's happened and it won't happen all at once so you'll start to get one or two that just drop off a little bit and again it's noticing that and going right do I intervene with those two now and can I give them another challenge to step it up so you might try that but as more and more start to drop off, that's usually your trigger and your cue to go out? I need to change something about this whole practice because there's something now that's not quite hitting their motivations. And I think you can hear it as well. I went to watch a coach a few weeks ago in the rival activity. The players were absolutely, like you could hear like the buzz. They were just buzzing, they were playing like this tag game and they were absolutely loving it. They were laughing, they were joking, they were messing about, but they were actually engaged in the practice, they were doing what they were asked to do, but they were loving it. You could literally, you could see it but if I'd have shut my eyes, you could hear it, but then moving into the next practice, you couldn't hear that anymore. And again, I'm stood there as the coach developer going, why has that happened? How has that suddenly gone from that to that? And that might be okay. That might be what the coach wants because we want to get them going, but then we might need to really focus in this particular moment. But if it's one extreme to the other, how might we just level it off a bit better so that we've still got that little bit of a buzz. It's not gone completely quiet. So I think, yeah, taking the time to observe what's the tempo, what's the energy saying, are there certain individuals that have dropped off, Is there something you can intervene with to give them a challenge? Because they might just need that little bit of differentiation to to challenge them a bit whilst the others are all right. But as more and more start to drop off, it's probably something that that needs adapting about the practice. But I think what I would also say as well, just as a bit of a warning sign on that kind of energy and tempo is sometimes it will be flat. And as coaches, it's about working out, is it flat and is it quiet because they're thinking and they're trying to work it out and that's not a bad thing, but I think you usually get that at the start of your practice. So if it's a new practice, something they've not done before, or if it's quite a complex practice or a new skill that you're trying to, it will be quite quiet. So don't take that as, oh, this is flat, I need to change it and get them buzzing again. It might just be that they're working it out. That's where, don't know whether this is just me, I can almost hear the cogs going and you can see them like the concentration on the face they're really trying to work it out and that's, I wouldn't intervene then unless someone really struggling and needs some help. So it's just finding that difference between when is it a quiet because it needs moving on, when is it a quiet because they're really focusing and concentrating. But yeah, it's always nice to hear that buzz and that excitement of when they're really enjoying a practice.
[00:38:02,937] [Jamie:] How important as well for thinking about developing connections with players, so obviously observational skills are key so that you can spot what's going on and you need to get to know players, but how important is then good communication skills to build connections with them as well?
[00:38:18,240] [Bex Garlick:] Yeah, I think it's just massive, I think we've spoken about questioning, never taking that first answer as just the answer, always trying to delve a little bit deeper. I think even like the tone and the volume of your voice, you know, when do we need to amp it up, when do we need to be a little bit louder, when might a softer approach, again when I gave you that example of when I went for a walk around the pitch with that player as the kids were playing and just had a chat about that behaviour, I was really soft with my voice, I didn't need to raise my voice and just tried to keep the situation as calm as possible by using my voice because I knew if I, again, if I was worked up, the player would get worked up as well and It's really difficult to, I think when sometimes when it's an emotion like frustration or anger or upset, I think, I think it's always a good thing to match, match an emotion in those moments. So again, yeah, if a player is frustrated, we can't meet them with frustration. I always, I can't remember who it was, gave us an example of using the voice and again, and we've all done it. So when you're talking to the players and they're talking automatically, we raise our voice, don't we? Cause we want to be heard and we want to give them the next instruction or so we'll raise our voice. But often what happens is you raise your voice, they raise theirs. The tip, I can't remember who said it, but they said just just like lower your voice, like whisper, because if you start whispering, they've got to stop to hear you. And I was like, nah, that'll never work. And then I went and did it. I was like, this is genius. I literally just like whisper and then they might be like, hang on a minute, what's Beck saying? And it worked. Another tip we used to do in the skills program, we used to write on our whiteboards like shhh but you just hold it up and they'd all be like and you could see him like nudging each other like shut up shut up Bex is talking like so I think yeah just trying not to match it always try and do the opposite I think that's a clever bit of advice for effective communication.
[00:40:20,020] [Jamie:] Yeah, I like that. I mean, I got told that on when I did the level one, like lowering your voice and it remarkably, it did work. I was quite surprised by it, but yeah, it did work. Everyone was listening then. So that was quite a nice tip to take away. Do coaches potentially have to tailor their communication like approach with different age groups at all?
[00:40:39,600] [Bex Garlick:] I'm not sure I think some people probably would say that they do like are we a bit more like upbeat and positive and energetic when we're working with really little ones compared to when we're working with adults but sometimes the adults need a bit of that because they've had a really stressful day and work's stressing them out, the kids are stressing them out, like they probably need as much as that as the under sixes do. So I think it's, I don't like to put things specifically on age and gender, I think it's just individual differences and what are the needs of the group in front of you, regardless of their age or gender.
[00:41:12,980] [Louise:] Really interesting. So looking at the FA Four Corner model, how important is it to ensure sessions cater for players' social needs?
[00:41:22,120] [Bex Garlick:] I think it's massive and I think football can be a really powerful tool for social change. It's probably why I do what I do, it's probably what gets me out of bed in the morning. In terms of helping players develop in the social corner, it's massive. We always used to give the stat on the courses around less than 0.7% of players will turn professional, 100% of them will become citizens of this country. So how are we helping them to be better as people? How are we helping them to develop those social skills that yes, right now can be used in football, but hopefully can be used in other aspects of their life as well. So yeah, it's massive.
[00:42:02,299] [Jamie:] How would you go about creating a session that then would work in the social corner?
[00:42:07,440] [Bex Garlick:] I think it's planning in opportunities for them to do that so I think we often talk about if they've been at school all day but then they get to football they want to talk about their day, so easy thing just give them a bit of time at the start to do that, like don't have your arrival activity so structured that they don't get the chance to do that. So that's an easy win in terms of that social corner, but I think if you're trying to develop them, it's just looking at what opportunities can you perhaps give certain players to lead on certain things if you're getting them into groups and getting them to solve a problem. Who is writing that on the whiteboard? Who's leading that discussion? Because I think sometimes it's naturally allowing that to happen, but if you naturally allow it to happen, it will often be the dominant characters that lead it. If you're wanting to develop social skills in all your players, who can you specifically put in charge of leading that discussion? Or who can you specifically put in charge of feeding back? So even if they don't necessarily lead the discussion, they'll feed it back. I think trying to plan practices where there's opportunities to have those discussions and have those chats, thinking of different ways in which you could do that. So if you have got someone who's like really shy, do you put them straight away in a situation where they've got to be in a group of like six or seven and have that conversation? Or actually, is it more beneficial for them to start developing those skills by putting them with a pair and having that conversation because it's easier in terms of the power dynamic when it's just me and you talking compared to when there's six of us in here and we've all got to fight to have our say. It's about being clever. There's also games that you can play. I used to, I think I stole this off one of the lads I used to work with, but it was called like fantasy football. And again, they all got to like pick which player they wanted to be. But as in fantasy football, you don't just get points for goals, you get points for assists, you get points for clean sheets, you get points as defenders, so they'd they'd have to interact because they'd have to decide who they were being and they'd have to come up with a team name but then at the end they'd have to work out how many points they'd got. So that was a really nice social game that I often used to demonstrate to coaches on courses as a real good one for the social corner but it doesn't have to be anything as as big as that it can just be subtle things that you do in your sessions like I said little group discussions, little paired discussions But giving them a real focus for those discussions again because I think this is knowing your players Some groups you can set off and they'll just talk all day But others need a real real clear guidance or a real clear question around what you're asking them to discuss So it's just about understanding your players again and what they need, who can just go off and have a chat and will actually stay focused and won't be talking about what they had for the tea last night, who needs some real specific, this is what I want you to talk about for the next couple of minutes and then come and feed back to me with these three things. But yeah, that's just about the language we use and the communication.
[00:45:04,279] [Louise:] So how can working in the social corner help coaches build connections with their team and help them develop more skilful players?
[00:45:13,260] [Bex Garlick:] I think when you set them off on those social tasks, you just learn so much about the players. Again, it's your perfect opportunity to just stand back, not say anything, and just observe and see how they interact. Where's the power dynamic? Who's leading the conversation? Who's stood at the back not saying anything? Who's desperate to say something, but can't quite find a way in. So I think you learn loads, but again I think it's about pocketing that information. Or even then, once you've observed something, like if there is someone stood at the back desperate to get in the conversation, I think just moving around and like your presence as a coach, to stand near them as they look at you, they then look at the other player that's stood at the side of you, desperate to say something, so that might be a way of getting them in. Or you might be like, so and so, what do you think? And I think that helps build connections. Cause again, they're seeing that you've recognized that and you've found a way to bring them in or found a way to help them. I think in terms of developing skill for players, I think when players are confident socially, they'll be confident on the pitch. And if you're giving them opportunities to lead, to communicate and get better at communicating with each other, to share how they're feeling, they're going to feel more comfortable on the pitch and confident to try new stuff and express themselves. Because again, if you've taken that time to build that trust between you and the player, but also between the players themselves, they know that if they do make a mistake, they've got that trust and they've got that backing. And again, last time I made that mistake, the coach was like, used a really soft tone with me, they didn't shout at me and they'll remember that stuff which will hopefully encourage them to just express themselves a bit more and naturally we'll hopefully develop more skilful players because they're trying stuff, they're getting stuff wrong but then they're learning from it and trying again and improving.
[00:47:01,300] [Louise:] Really interesting discussion there so thank you.
[00:47:04,120] [Jamie:] Right, well thank you very much for that chat Bex, it's been really insightful and so many top tips. We have gone over time a little bit so we'll not be able to squeeze our favourite part in the Swiss session, but there's so many tips there that hopefully the community and coaches listening will be able to take stuff away there. So thank you very much.
[00:47:21,100] [Bex Garlick:] No problem, enjoyed it, thank you.
[00:47:23,443] [Jamie:] Right, well that is all we have time for today but don't forget to check out the episode description for all the links to our platforms. There you will be able to click through to the England Football Community. This is where you can post your coaching questions for us to discuss on the podcast or just simply to connect with loads of wonderful coaches.